Veggies and Herbs.....what to start indoors when????

here’s my expertise: nothing “needs” to be started indoors, well not by me anyway.. I will purchase the plants already started by some other expert.
Plants: I purchase tomato plants and pepper plants.
Everything else, I put the seeds right into the ground on “May 24th” weekend.

-- - Debbie, SW Ontario Canada (USDA Hardiness Zone: 5a)

I’m with you Deb … except for putting seeds into the ground. No luck for me with seeds; or maybe no patience.

BUT … I do know lots of folks do start their plants from seeds inside. This would be an interesting and useful thread for sure.

-- "A perfect garden is just a garden to be in-perfection. Mornings to work on it and evenings to pause and look at it." Southeast Michigan, Zone 5a/5b

Starting indoors is good for things that are either very slow growing or starting, or that you’d like to bloom a little ahead of the natural schedule. Last season we started moonflowers indoors so that they’d get a good start.

Bullseye, you’ve got a great grow-rack, so you’ll have little trouble getting things going. You might want to get some of your culinaries going, such as basil or chives indoors, if you want those for seasoning your food…

-- Living on the square...Metro Detroit

I haven’t even got any seeds yet

-- Hooked on Gardening.....Ontario zone 5b

Well, get out to the tire store, and pick up some eggs, bread, and seeds!

-- Living on the square...Metro Detroit

haha that’s funny.. tire, eggs, bread, seeds lol
that would be Wal-Mart :)

-- - Debbie, SW Ontario Canada (USDA Hardiness Zone: 5a)

Only in North America eh :-)

-- Hooked on Gardening.....Ontario zone 5b

Yah, ain’t it great!! :-)

-- "A perfect garden is just a garden to be in-perfection. Mornings to work on it and evenings to pause and look at it." Southeast Michigan, Zone 5a/5b

So we went through our list last night, and this is what we plan to start with in our 1st year veggie planting

Sweet Million tomato-
golden cherry tomato
beefsteak organic tomato
big beef tomato
carnival tomato

Other Vegetables:

Cucumber ( thunder cucumber, stonewall, and salad bush cucumber ) zucchini ( richgreen and eight ball ) eggplant ( dusky eggplant, fairy tale eggplant ) radish ( rebel radish, Rudolph radish ) pea vines bean vines squash ( vegetable spaghetti squash ) spinach ( Tyee spinach ) carrots ( touchon carrot, chantenay red core carrot ) lettuce ( looseleaf or Romaine 2 – 3 inches apart ) corn ( peaches n cream ) onions ( greek salad onions, red beauty onions, and norstar onions ) potatoes ( sweet potatoes, and the other one ) How do you plant these?????

Bell red peppers ( fat n sassy, king Arthur and Socrates )

herbs… thyme, rosemary, chives, basil, oregano, dill, horse radish

So what do you guys think…..thoughts and suggestions

-- Hooked on Gardening.....Ontario zone 5b

I think you are in for a lot of work but will reap great rewards!!

watch the horse radish.. it will spread. lots.

regular potatoes.. cut up a potato, making sure there is at least one eye in each section.. toss it in the ground.. pile some dirt on top and watch for the potato bugs.
Here’s a nice article

-- - Debbie, SW Ontario Canada (USDA Hardiness Zone: 5a)

I know it’s a bit of a cliche’, but “no pain, no gain” :-)

-- Hooked on Gardening.....Ontario zone 5b

or now labour in your own garden, then lots of fossil fuels and contaminates to get them from the grocery store :)
is that the same thing? haha

-- - Debbie, SW Ontario Canada (USDA Hardiness Zone: 5a)

Its the first time I have heard about cutting potatoes in to pieces before you sew…...........is this for real

-- Derbyshire------- English Countryside

Apparently….the old dear in the article looks like she knows her onions, so to speak.

-- Hooked on Gardening.....Ontario zone 5b

Well, “us” old folk sometimes do know our stuff … Deb, GREAT article—- thanks!!

-- "A perfect garden is just a garden to be in-perfection. Mornings to work on it and evenings to pause and look at it." Southeast Michigan, Zone 5a/5b

well back on the farm when I was little, when we grew potatoes, that’s what we did. Cut, cut, cut..

-- - Debbie, SW Ontario Canada (USDA Hardiness Zone: 5a)

I had never heard of that before … but guess when you really think about a potato, it is a “root”. Again, what I love about this site … the stuff you learn is amazing!! :-)

-- "A perfect garden is just a garden to be in-perfection. Mornings to work on it and evenings to pause and look at it." Southeast Michigan, Zone 5a/5b

Debbie I’m going to try cutting the potatoes this year, and I will let you know how I get on, I may even show you if I get any pictures.

-- Derbyshire------- English Countryside

Something to keep in mind about taters: they leach MAJOR nutrients out of the ground. If you’re compelled to plant potatoes each season, it might be a good idea to rotate your plantings and give the other beds a chance to recuperate with enrichment and less demanding plantings (like say, annuals).

-- Living on the square...Metro Detroit

I have read about other people starting tomatoes in January, but most sites say to start them later around March. Now that we’ve got tomato out of the way, can any of you please give the Month to Start the following INDOORS in Zone 5b:

1. Cucumber
2. Zucchini
3. Eggplant
4. Radish
5. Scarlet runner beans
6. Baby pak choi
7. Carrots
8. Lettuce
9. Onions ( norstar and red onions )
10. Bell red peppers
11. Brussel sprouts
12. Parsley
13. Thyme
14. Rosemary
15. Basil

-- Hooked on Gardening.....Ontario zone 5b

I don’t know specifics, BUllseye but here’s what I do… buy the seeds early and then follow the directions on the back.
I’ve started seeds early in the past but was just reading somewhere that their plants do better if they stick to the “6 weeks” or whatever recommendation on the package.

-- - Debbie, SW Ontario Canada (USDA Hardiness Zone: 5a)

My veggie kung fu is weak, so I’ll just give what advice I do know on herbs…which is plant ‘em whenever! The sooner you get going on the herbs, the sooner you’ll get consumable herbs.

On Rosemary, I’ve heard stories that this is a real bear to start on seeds. Try ‘em out, but you may be better off getting small divisions or seedlings to be more successful.

-- Living on the square...Metro Detroit

I’ve always cut potatoes…Just use chunks with good “eyes”. Actually I get a few lbs of potatoes in my compost every year just from peels.

As for when to start your seeds:

1. Cucumber – indoors 60 days before last frost
2. Zucchini – indoors 60 days before last frost
3. Eggplant – indoors 60 days before last frost
4. Radish – Direct sow outside and sow every two weeks for a continous harvest – these grow very fast
5. Scarlet runner beans – Direct sow after last frost
6. Baby pak choi – Direct sow after last frost
7. Carrots – Direct sow 2 weeks before last frost and heavily mulch
8. Lettuce – Direct sow after last frost – for leaf lettuces sow every 2 weeks for continous harvest
9. Onions ( norstar and red onions ) if sets – direct sow 2 weeks before last frost and heavily mulch…if seeds start indoors 90 days before last frost date
10. Bell red peppers indoors 60 days before last frost
11. Brussel sprouts- Direct sow after last frost
12. Parsley – start indoors on widowsill anytime
13. Thyme – start indoors on widowsill anytime
14. Rosemary – start indoors on widowsill anytime
15. Basil – start indoors on widowsill anytime (grow with tomatoes to deter bugs)

Hope this helps

-- Xploreorganics, 5b Canada, LFD 06-20

Thanks for that! I forgot to add that my last frost date is May 24

-- Hooked on Gardening.....Ontario zone 5b

Hi BullsEye

I started a lot of things inside last year, but it was my first year doing more than “a few” things and I kind of went crazy, starting things too early. This year, I’m making a chart according to the directions on the back of the seed chart. My theory is it’s easier to germinate certain things inside than to wait for the soil to warm up enough, being that I’m in a cooler climate than you and the growing season is short. Also, I’m planning to repeat my experiment from last year on putting part of my tomatoes (and maybe even a few peppers) out extra-early under protection. So I recommend the chart method. That way you can just plant a few things each week starting around the first of March.

By the way, were you planning on putting them under grow lights? Hightly recommended! Here’s a pic of last yr’s set-up. (Lights turned off so you can see the set-up.)

-- Gardening in the North! (zone 3/4) http://www.HealthyLivingDIY.com

Yes I am….I have posted pics of my setup here in another thread before.

-- Hooked on Gardening.....Ontario zone 5b

Does this advice sound about right to you guys?

“Cucumber and Zucchini can be started in containers 2 to 3 weeks before you plan to set them out, but much more than that would not be good for them. Lettuce can be started indoors probably now, I grow mine outdoors in winter (zone 8b) with no protection. Eggplant and tomato—about 6-8 weeks before setting out. Onion and brussel sprouts are a cold weather plants and could start now. Parsley and thyme are cold weather herbs and could start now—I’m not familiar enough with rosemary to know, but I believe it grows outdoors as a perennial here.

Radish, beans and carrots are probably best planted directly in the ground, beans after all danger of frost, radish and carrots when the ground can be worked.”

-- Hooked on Gardening.....Ontario zone 5b

Ok, great. I’m new so I’ll have to try and find it. Good luck.

-- Gardening in the North! (zone 3/4) http://www.HealthyLivingDIY.com

From what I hear, starting rosemary from seed is dicey. May not germinate well. Also, from what I hear, it can be a challenge to protect in the ground through the winter. I would guess in your climate you’d really have to baby it if you wanted to try and keep it outside. Although I usually start as much as possible from seed, I made an exception and got a small rosemary plant last spring. Planted it in a large-ish pot and left it outside all summer. Then this fall I brought it inside. It’s doing great in a south window! Just last week I took a couple cuttings and am trying to propagate more rosemary that way. So far the cuttings are still alive. :-)

-- Gardening in the North! (zone 3/4) http://www.HealthyLivingDIY.com

hi there, sounds like i’ve got a companion! I’ve started 99% of my veggie/herb garden plants for the last… dunno how many years. Mostly because i got tired of growing the same old tomote varrieties and really wanted to branch out in the pepper section! As for how you start things, depends on what your looking to put out. I find tha with cucumbers if I grew them under lights, they were the first thing to get lanky and either suffer damage or start running. Zucchini is in a simular boat, it’s a bit more durable, but will take up space in no time. Both plants are ones that excelle in the ground anyways. so basically I just want them germinated and beginning to run. So if your varriety says it takes a week to germinate, I might plant it so that I have it to grow for maybe 3 weeks. I’ve yet to grow eggplant from seed, did grow 4 plants (which for any average family is way to much just to warn ya!). Pak choi (liks chard, choi andspinach) I like to start a few weeks before planting out just so that i have a nice even spacing for my rows and can select the bigger and better platlestts to put out in the row. I treat beans in a simular way, mostly because I don’t want to either replant because some didn’t come up, or have to thin them, hate to waste the seed. Carrots and letuce i think both can be sown in the garden before frost, package will say, some say just to put protective plastic overtop. Radish same thing. Onions if your looking for full size onions this year start them indoors soon. youll end up with pots of grass by spring that you can seperate and plant out singles. Parsleys a bit trickey atleast for me to start form seed, most times a friend gives me a few plants, and i end up planting seeds around the base that show up sometime in summer. I believe they take about 30 days to sprout or something crazy long like that, so take that into acount. I know nothing aout brussel sprouts cant stand them! all i do know is that by the early fall when the sprouts start to show up you have to cut all the lower leaves off. Thyme is one of those weedy herbs, I just sprinkled a pinch of seeds ontop a 4” pot maybe a month before planting out, bu then i had a good sprout and busshy bunch of seedlings, then ripped the pots rootball into about 6 peices and planted it in the row. When i grew rosemary from seed, i didn’t find it hard to germinate, its just very slow growing, and was succeptable to damp off. If i don’t do my own cuttings in the spring, I go to a place like zerhs that has fresh herbs, pick up a pack recut the ends, dip in rooting hormone and root them myself. You can do basil like thyme. you can actully root alot of herbs that you’ll find at the grocery store fresh.

Peppers are a big reason i grow my own plants. I can do chinese giants, big berthas, big dipper, ect… I tend to start them before i start my tomatoe plants, i like to see some size on them. like maybe 2 weeks before tomatoes.

hope this helps and wasn’t a big ramble!
Sib ;)

never would have thought of picking up some herbs at the store and replanting them. cool

(and ramble all you want – I love people who are a wealth of knowledge!!!)

-- - Debbie, SW Ontario Canada (USDA Hardiness Zone: 5a)

Sib,

Wow….Thanks for all that, I really appreciate it! So when do you start your tomatoes and peppers, if for example your last frost date is May 24?

-- Hooked on Gardening.....Ontario zone 5b

depends on how big i want my plants and if i’ll be doing them under lights or in my green house (buggers still in the dozen boxes). I’m hoping i’ll have my green house up to work in. so i’m thinking april for the majority of tomats (early april for beefsteaks, and earlies, cherry tomats will be a bit later), peppers might be a bit earlier… yeah, i have the same plant weekend, though it usually depends more on my garden and if i can get the darn thing rototilled or if its a boggy muddy mess.
Sib ;)

I’d like to comment on the potato thread. I dig a trench about a foot deep and plant the potatoes, as they grow I fill in the trench with straw and pinch a small branch off here and there under the straw to promote root growth. Then as I need potatoes I move the straw and pick what I need. I do have good drainage in my sandy soil.

-- Central Valley California

never heard of that method before, Ron.. thanks.

-- - Debbie, SW Ontario Canada (USDA Hardiness Zone: 5a)

nice method ron! I’ve only grown potatoes once, ended up with defoliated plants because we couldn’t controle potatoe bug (not the cute sow bugs) we don’t use chemicals really. Heck after the finished the potatoes, they started on tomatoes, but fortunately they didn’t like them as much!
Sib ;)

Starting plants inside can be difficult for some folks, possibly the lighting is poor, or lack of funds to buy the needed light.
Others, like myself, have learned the best approach through many years of experience.
Here at Our farm, being exclusively Heirloom gardeners, we start everything, and I do mean everything, besides corn and potatoes indoors.
start out small, gain experience.
Sunny window sills are great for a small flat of greens, herbs, etc. but may not be as suited for tomatoes, peppers, etc. The light available may make them leggy, which in the case of tomatoes, may not be bad, porvided they don’t get too extended.
We bury all but the upper most leaves anyway.
But..every year starting the 2nd. week of February here in Minnesota, the lights come on…one fixture at a time, starting with onions, in a couple more weeks, the the cole crops, then on the tomatoes and peppers and all the warmer “heat” loving plants a few weeks later.

Starting your own plants inside is not only rewarding, the selection and varieties available to you are vast.

-- Old Pharmer Phils Country Living Phorum - http://pharmerphil.proboards37.com

I wrote a post on Planning an Annual Vegetable garden. Find it here: http://www.gardenhelp.org/gardening/gardening-from-seeds-or-from-starts/

-- GardenMentor, Seattle, WA (zone 8/9), www.gardenmentors.com & www.gardenhelp.org

awesome! thanks.

-- - Debbie, SW Ontario Canada (USDA Hardiness Zone: 5a)

Thanks for the link gardenmentor

-- Hooked on Gardening.....Ontario zone 5b

I started my Tomatoes, onions and brussel sprouts last week, and they have now sprouted

-- Hooked on Gardening.....Ontario zone 5b

I’m doing my taters in a plastic barrel with straw/compost this year.

Bob

-- I want to believe in a lot of things but, in the meantime I have to deal with the truth

Talar, when you get a chance you’ll have to share with us your gardens … maybe once everything is planted. Would enjoy seeing them! :-)

-- "A perfect garden is just a garden to be in-perfection. Mornings to work on it and evenings to pause and look at it." Southeast Michigan, Zone 5a/5b

I keep my song herbs (Parsley Sage Roemary and Thyme and chives )over each winter and grow new replacements each year.
We use them all winter as well this way.

Bob

-- I want to believe in a lot of things but, in the meantime I have to deal with the truth

Hey, I don’t recall chives being in the song..

Not sure what we’re doing for an herb garden yet. Still got to get the tiller going so I can prep the plot.

-- Planting Daylilies in Kentucky, zone 6b

Scott, -Chives was the drummer.
...and as we know, Drummers never get any recognition! <g>
Bob

-- I want to believe in a lot of things but, in the meantime I have to deal with the truth

WHAT ABOUT RUNNER BEANS DEAD EASY TO GROW UP 6 FOOT CANES THEIR HUGE YIELDS MAKE IT A MUST . PICK THEM YOUNG BOIL FOR 8 TO 10 MINUTES ,DRAIN MELT BUTTER OVER THEM AND SEASON WITH PEPPER, WONDERFUL THE ONES YOU MISS E.G. LONGER ONES CUT THEM UP SMALL AND USE THEM IN PICKLES OR CHUTNEY.
REGARDS MIKE

-- MIKE MILTON COMMON U.K.

Bob….that is not true, just look at Phil Collins of Genesis

-- Hooked on Gardening.....Ontario zone 5b

Bullseye, O.K. that one. <g>
Good thing he could sing , that all I can say!

• How do you tell if the stage is level? The drummer is drooling from both sides of his mouth.

• How can you tell a drummer’s at the door?
The knocking speeds up.

• What’s the last thing a drummer says in a band?
“Hey guys, why don’t we try one of my songs?

• What do you call a drummer that breaks up with his girlfriend?
Homeless.

• How can you tell when a drummer’s at the door?
He doesn’t know when to come in

Bob

-- I want to believe in a lot of things but, in the meantime I have to deal with the truth

lol oh you gotta love musician jokes! lol
my daughter is a clarinet player

-- - Debbie, SW Ontario Canada (USDA Hardiness Zone: 5a)

GrandmaT…..good call about wanting to see pictures!

-- Hooked on Gardening.....Ontario zone 5b

WHAT ABOUT GENE CRUPER AND ERIC DELAYNEY
MIKE

-- MIKE MILTON COMMON U.K.

I plant peas and rommaine lettuce as soon as I can work the soil….......like maybe this week-end

Like Debbie, I buy the plants that I need and put seeds in May 24

-- Central northish Ontario

radishes too

-- Central northish Ontario

I HAVE GOT A POT IN THE GREENHOUSE ON THE FLOOR WITH RADISHES IN AND NEXT TO IT A PLASTIC TROUGH WITH A LINE OF ROCKET ON ONE SIDE MIXED LETTUCE LEAVES ON THE OTHER SIDE AND RADISHES IN BETWEEN. YOU DON`T NEED HIGH TEMPERATURES JUST FROST FREE ALL WILL GROW IN ABOUT 4 WEEKS , AS YOU PULL IT UP SOW MORE SEED IN THE GAPS LEFT GREAT FO EARLY FRESH SALADS . ( TROUGH SIZE 3 FOOT LONG 9 INCHES WIDE AND 9 INCHES DEEP )
REGARDS MIKE

-- MIKE MILTON COMMON U.K.

I have to start looking for somewhere to get 7yrds of triple mix I need for my veggie bed, for a decent price. A few places I checked out so far, are asking for too much and the quality of the soil might not be up to scratch

-- Hooked on Gardening.....Ontario zone 5b

do you need it delivered Bullseye?
How far away are you willing to go for it?

(not that I can be of much help.. I don’t know what the going rate is for the soil or quality)

-- - Debbie, SW Ontario Canada (USDA Hardiness Zone: 5a)

Debs,

I don’t mind going as far your neck of the woods for it, but yes I’ll need it delivered.

-- Hooked on Gardening.....Ontario zone 5b

I don’t know if these people deliver.
I was at the garden centre in Holbrook (west of Burgessville- another 1/2 hour west). I think they said that triple mix was $37/yard.

-- - Debbie, SW Ontario Canada (USDA Hardiness Zone: 5a)

$259 for my 7yrds then. I wonder if that includes tax? I can use this new price as mydefacto price when looking at other deals out there.

-- Hooked on Gardening.....Ontario zone 5b

http://72.14.205.104/search?q=cache:-W__rhUl2yIJ:www.botanixois.on.ca/Newsletters/Newsletter_Vol%252014_Spring%25202004.pdf+botanix+holbrook&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1&gl=ca&client=firefox-a this gives some information about them.

-- - Debbie, SW Ontario Canada (USDA Hardiness Zone: 5a)

I just ordered 10 yrds from a very local place, for $20/yrd. They had a thing where if you buy 10 yrds or more, delivery is free. It came to $200 and that includes tax

I look forward to the heavy work of wheeling it to the veggie bed

-- Hooked on Gardening.....Ontario zone 5b

I could never get radishes to grow. They did grow but nothing but a spindly root – easier to store purchase when needed.

-- blooz 5b - You can bury a lot of troubles digging in the dirt. ~author unkown

excellent, Bullseye!!
Now I wonder if they delivery out here :)

-- - Debbie, SW Ontario Canada (USDA Hardiness Zone: 5a)

Hmmm…that is tricky, considering your location :-) I had a hard time finding you 1st time around

-- Hooked on Gardening.....Ontario zone 5b

hahaha it’s not that hard.. just 2 turns!!! :)
lol

-- - Debbie, SW Ontario Canada (USDA Hardiness Zone: 5a)

So you keep tellin me :-)

-- Hooked on Gardening.....Ontario zone 5b

easiest way is of the 403… harder directions if you go the back roads ;)

-- - Debbie, SW Ontario Canada (USDA Hardiness Zone: 5a)

What is a good veggie fertilizer to put in the soil befoe you plant the seeds

I use manure and my compost but it isn’t enough

I can’t produce enough compost from one persosn to make it work well so the veggie garden needs a boost

thanks

-- NS Zone 5B 200 KM East of Halifax cheers Bunting------Having a place to go – is a home. Having someone to love – is a family.

My tomatoes and peppers are doing very well, so is the brussel sprout

-- Hooked on Gardening.....Ontario zone 5b

Bunting, I too am looking for a good veggie fertilizer. Will check at the nursery when I pickup the soil etc.

-- blooz 5b - You can bury a lot of troubles digging in the dirt. ~author unkown

Some of you have a nice list of veggies that you have started from seed

I should have to but didn’t

Bob

You posted about growing your tarters in a plastic barrel with straw

How do you do that if it’s ok if I ask. ?

-- NS Zone 5B 200 KM East of Halifax cheers Bunting------Having a place to go – is a home. Having someone to love – is a family.

My Romaine lettuce, planted in the ground today

-- Hooked on Gardening.....Ontario zone 5b

Looking good B!

-- Eklectic, Follow my Bliss, South East Ontario 5a

garden is looking good Bunting.I love the blackness to your dirt.

-- Bon,Hastings,Ont.....zone 5a....Always room for one more

awesome. My romaine didn’t start … so I’ll have to purchase some plants if I can find some.

-- - Debbie, SW Ontario Canada (USDA Hardiness Zone: 5a)

There are places selling them by the packs for a decent fee, just look around

-- Hooked on Gardening.....Ontario zone 5b

I just finished planting all my veggies out in the veggie bed just now ( 9:15pm ). I had to be dragged in by the mrs :-) The thing is, once I have that momentum going, I don’t like to take a break.

peppers
tomatoes
celery
cucumber
brussel sprouts
lettuce

-- Hooked on Gardening.....Ontario zone 5b

It is nice to get in that “grove” ... loose all track of time. Sounds like there is gonna be some good eatin’ later this summer!! Yum :-)

-- "A perfect garden is just a garden to be in-perfection. Mornings to work on it and evenings to pause and look at it." Southeast Michigan, Zone 5a/5b

9:15 PM I was heading to bed almost… I was So tired from all the planting in the morning.

Sounds like a delicious list of salad ingredients!! :) Yummy

-- - Debbie, SW Ontario Canada (USDA Hardiness Zone: 5a)